Damage calculations in Banish...

[VillainX]

OK. For some time I've been wondering how the damage calculations are made for Banish. In forest realm, on Server 1, we have one of the largest players in the game in our guild, yet in banish, he is not getting even double the damage some of the other top players in the realm are getting. I do understand that not all of his power is attack power, and that stuns account for some of the variance in total damage... but with me being 12 mil power, and him being over 40 mil power, you would think that he would be way over doubling damage on us 12-15 mil guys... After thinking of several factors, some of which seem like a long shot, I think I may be able to explain it.

What I think is happening, is that the banish boss has a variable defense that's based off of our attack talent levels (per player). I may be off on this equation, but here is a round about idea of how i think it is calculated...

total attack power vs boss defense (boss defense is variable based on talents) x stuns = damage

NOW. Let me state that I do NOT believe that talents upgrades are useless against Banish bosses... More that they not only act as a power boost, but also a defensive base to keep the banishes more balanced.

Let me also state, that I know formation plays a huge role in banish strategy. Myself and a few others in my guild have run the exact same formation for banish, one being 1 mil power below me, and the other being 3 mil power above me, and the results ofc still vary because of stuns, and all 3 of us have pretty much gone back and forth using the same form over a period of time. I think the bosses defense is different for each player based on their attack talents. (Strength of Steel, Physical Amplifier, and Magic Attack). It explains how players that have such huge differences in power can close the gap in banish events, even though in PvP they are nowhere close.

This, of course is just a theory, but I would love feedback and possibly if anyone can think of ways to test this, I think it could help us further perfect the art of banish.

Discuss.

[Herby]

Maybe. Just Maybe. Your #1 player's 40 million power is mostly from Health Point and Defense Bonuses.

Formation also makes a big difference in Banish results.

[Klepto]

The reason is mostly stuns, not the damage portion necessarily. My damage, depending on luck, can fluctuate from let's say 75% of average (bad round) to 500%+ of average (amazing round), with many wide variances in between.

Really, it's basically like rolling a single dice over and over again for 30 minutes, once every minute, and then adding up the results. That's why even lower power players can get close, because the variance factor has such a wide range. Theoretically a person could one-hit the World Boss if they got lucky enough, irrespective of power.

Also, reloading after every round helps to avoid being stuck in a good round over a minute and losing potential DPS. That plays a huge role for a lower player catching a higher one.

[mattp169]

Herby, you need to read.

Klepto stuns are only one part of it.

I am one of teh players in this daily lottery for top 3.

Our number #1 player with 40m+ power versus my 16m power
His weapons are 20-30 levels higher then mine
his spirits are 15-20 levels higher then mine
his attack talents are 10-20 levels higher then mine
yet he only does about 2-4% more damage then me.
sometime more sometimes less.
With all that ability to do more damage then me, it seems there is something limiting the actual damage you do in banish.

The same is true with me and villainx. My weapons,spirits, and attack levels are higher by a few levels, yet he can beat me by up to 3% some days , some days I am a few % ahead of him and other days we are neck and neck.
Now that difference could be explained with just stuns.
But we both believe there is something significantly more going on then just stuns. many of us believe that SOMETHING is limiting damage in banish.

[Herby]

Herby, you need to read.

Klepto stuns are only one part of it.

I am one of teh players in this daily lottery for top 3.

Our number #1 player with 40m+ power versus my 16m power
His weapons are 20-30 levels higher then mine
his spirits are 15-20 levels higher then mine
his attack talents are 10-20 levels higher then mine
yet he only does about 2-4% more damage then me.
sometime more sometimes less.
With all that ability to do more damage then me, it seems there is something limiting the actual damage you do in banish.

The same is true with me and villainx. My weapons,spirits, and attack levels are higher by a few levels, yet he can beat me by up to 3% some days , some days I am a few % ahead of him and other days we are neck and neck.
Now that difference could be explained with just stuns.
But we both believe there is something significantly more going on then just stuns. many of us believe that SOMETHING is limiting damage in banish.

In that case, I fully agree with Klepto's answer.

It's the formation and the stuns.

[Deucalion]

In that case, I fully agree with Klepto's answer.

It's the formation and the stuns.

Your wrong.


Matt and Villian, you guys are onto something here. I have noticed exactly the same thing in Water Realm. I think there is a "Balancing System" in place to 1. Keep us from killing 250m bosses in 4-5 mins and 2. to allow smaller players a chance to rank in the top ten, getting decent damage %'s. There is also something with this that messes with the boosting system as well. I can do more damage with a 60% boost than a 100% boost some days.
I beleive this system that is in place for Banish Bosses is "tweakable" and that they change the values often to keep us on our toes. What will be cool is when we get the 500m or better yet a 1b Banish boss to mess around with.
Nice work

[Revan]

Your wrong.


Matt and Villian, you guys are onto something here. I have noticed exactly the same thing in Water Realm. I think there is a "Balancing System" in place to 1. Keep us from killing 250m bosses in 4-5 mins and 2. to allow smaller players a chance to rank in the top ten, getting decent damage %'s. There is also something with this that messes with the boosting system as well. I can do more damage with a 60% boost than a 100% boost some days.
I beleive this system that is in place for Banish Bosses is "tweakable" and that they change the values often to keep us on our toes. What will be cool is when we get the 500m or better yet a 1b Banish boss to mess around with.
Nice work

If you could kill it in 4-5 (by the math 12 minutes or less should trigger the next power up) that would in theory cause the WB to up in HP next day (theoretically speaking of course). Also based on the trends of WB powerups that are already known, theoretically the WB would go from 250 million to 1.25 billion HP. I came tthat conclusion based on the fact originally he is at 10 million, then times 5 for 50 million, and then time 5 again to get 250 million.

oh and there does seem to be some sort of balancing system in place.

[VillainX]

I think you guys are missing where I said in the op that we have ran the same form testing stuff out... there is no way the top player consistently gets less stuns than use every day using cianna and shayd just like we do... just not possible even if the most random of things.

[mattp169]

Once again you all cant read
we are using the same formation

Formation is not a factor in this.
I can use a slightly different formation and get same results.

STuns are only part of it
stuns can somewhat explain the differences between me,villainx and the 3 or 4 others who are really close in power to each other and how we swap around the top spots.
But it can not explain the difference in Specwar's attack power and ours and how we can get as close as 2% below him in total damage. And when I say attack power i mean the 3 attack talents,weapons and spirits ONLY.

If it were stuns, why does Specwar consistently for weeks upon weeks get far fewer stuns then everyone else in the realm. Because if it was only stuns, that is what would have to happen. And stuns are way to random for one person to always get less then others. SO we believe there is more to it then only stuns

[VillainX]

I think this can be tested obviously by only upgrading defensive talent when queues come up, and only upgrading offensive weapons. I have been upgrading offensive talents and defensive weapons for the past 4-5 days now, including my run of speedups for thor's day today, and my bloodstorm went from averaging 95k damage per hit to hitting around 82k for most, highest being 90k. This is one thing that makes me think that offensive talents may be some sort of limiter, or better said "regulator" to keep balance in the banish events.